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+--- Thread: Mortgages for a Brave New World (Sarcasm) (/showthread.php?tid=66666)
Re: Mortgages for a Brave New World (Sarcasm) - mattkime - 11-21-2008
>>I respectfully disagree.
You can respectfully disagree all you want but the expansion of the subprime mortgage market that you're referring to had nothing to do with its eventual downfall. the only people throwing around this idea have political aims. wall st and financial experts don't even talk about it.
Re: Mortgages for a Brave New World (Sarcasm) - Stizzealth - 11-21-2008
You can argue with the delivery, but I might say that it's difficult to argue with the message.
Re: Mortgages for a Brave New World (Sarcasm) - Stizzealth - 11-21-2008
You are correct in that the expansion of the subprime market didn't cause it to collapse. It's expansion did, however, widen its circle of impact when it DID collapse. Unfortunately, that circle of impact pretty much nailed our credit market to the wall.
Re: Mortgages for a Brave New World (Sarcasm) - AlphaDog - 11-21-2008
Stizzealth wrote:
AlphaDog:
I see what you're saying. Of course, I'd like nothing more than to see Obama succeed spectacularly. My aim in broaching this topic is to generate a public dialogue on what the President-Elect should or shouldn't do and hopefully, with the help of others who are discussing the same topic, prevent him from making a dangerous mistake.
Yes, there's a lot riding on this! So far he seems to be trying very hard to move rather slowly and collect thoughts and ideas from a wide variety of people. Of course the other reality is that anything he proposes is going to have to receive the support of Congress, and who knows how that will go. There's a lot of talk about bipartisan support to do whatever is good for the country, but none of them have had to walk their talk yet!
Re: Mortgages for a Brave New World (Sarcasm) - Stizzealth - 11-21-2008
We can only hope that when it comes time for the talkers to walk, they do it well enough. It's the only country I've got, anyways.
Good night, folks!
Re: Mortgages for a Brave New World (Sarcasm) - Greg the dogsitter - 11-21-2008
Stizzealth wrote:
You can argue with the delivery, but I might say that it's difficult to argue with the message.
I guess further analysis is silly, then.
Re: Mortgages for a Brave New World (Sarcasm) - mattkime - 11-21-2008
>>It's expansion did, however, widen its circle of impact when it DID collapse.
but that has a hell of a lot more due to the demand for mortgage backed securities outstripping supply. and the banks repackaging mortgages so they wouldn't suffer the consequences of the bad mortgages they were writing (which they did anyway). and the individuals interacting with buyers of mortgages were getting paid big money for closing these deals. and how far did these bad loans travel? they were sold worldwide, the chinese holding a ton so we could keep buying the stuff they make.
but you'd rather just say "its the dem's fault"
Re: Mortgages for a Brave New World (Sarcasm) - Stizzealth - 11-21-2008
Just gotta square this last post away before I sleep.
Nevertheless, Fannie and Freddie didn't have to get into the market in the way they did. The fact of the matter is that if Fannie and Freddie hadn't bought the crappy mortgages, the banks that were making them would:
A. Have to stop making them because they didn't have a buyer
B. If they continued to make them, when the market collapsed the problem would have been localized
You state that the loans traveled to China. This is true, and it shouldn't have happened. It did, however, because Freddie and Fannie packaged the bad loans into mortgage-backed securities (just in on the rumor line: apparently, they sometimes packaged the same mortgage more than once) and sold them off China. If Fannie and Freddie hadn't gotten into the market, we wouldn't be having this problem.
Re: Mortgages for a Brave New World (Sarcasm) - mattkime - 11-21-2008
>>If Fannie and Freddie hadn't gotten into the market, we wouldn't be having this problem.
a) i'm not sure thats true because the demand for mortgage backed securities still would have existed.
b) even if it was, there's a difference between being part of historical events and willful negligence.
Re: Mortgages for a Brave New World (Sarcasm) - Dennis S - 11-21-2008
Stizzealth wrote:
We can only hope that when it comes time for the talkers to walk, they do it well enough. It's the only country I've got, anyways.
Good night, folks!
Good night, pete.