Wow, setting up a Ring alarm system is REALLY easy.

[PeterB]

OK, I just skimmed over that NYT article, and I gotta say ... none of that really bothers me very much. Since all of my cameras face outside, and they're all visible either from the street or the porch, anyone could see what the cameras are capable of seeing. If my local law enforcement wanted the videos, I'd therefore have no problem with that. They have in fact already contacted me a couple of times to check and see if I had any useful footage of the area after a crime has occurred, but unfortunately the placement of my cameras is such that it'd be highly unlikely I'd have anything useful for them.

And as for the Neighbors part of the Ring app, I have actually found that incredibly useful -- particularly because it gives some real-time alerting of things happening in the neighborhood that we might all want to know about... the most common thing here being either "was that gunshots or fireworks?" and "another porch pirate has struck". ::o

As for Ring/Amazon, again, they can see what is publicly visible anyway. Regarding the alarm system, that'd just give them info about my comings and goings, which frankly again I feel is not particularly useful or interesting information, especially with us all now being under corona conditions ... where people are likely to be home a lot anyway.

[Robert M]

Matt,

You have to give your trust to someone if you choose to have an alarm system with central station monitoring. All the more so if you want app and cloud based services with the alarm system. If you don't like Ring (and Amazon), choose a different provider. However, that provider is likely working with other companies to provide some of its services.

Case in point. At my office, the system is configured properly and as secure as reasonably possible. Our alarm system and central station monitoring provider uses alarm.com for some of its services. Alarm.com is a 3rd party that provides services for a slew of alarm companies, not just mine.

Do I trust Alarm.com? No. If I want app and cloud services with my office's alarm system, then I don't have an alternative. Our provider works with Alarm.com and if I want the services, I have to go with it. Just like with Ring (and Amazon), the benefits of the services _way_ outweigh any concerns I have with the company.

Robert

[mattkime]

Its a tradeoff. Some people might be surprised that the footage from their security cameras might be used without their knowledge. A clear alternative is having a system that records locally. Different people will navigate this differently.

[jdc]

RAMd®d wrote:
Just having an alarm that goes beep beep is likely more than enough to keep many away?

That's just adorable.
In my experience, an audible alarm merely tells a burglar to hurry up.
Whether or not a service benefits a subscriber has it's variables.
Depending on an alarm to 'keep many away' is almost no plan at all.
But better than nothing, to be sure.
I am a fan of motion-activated flood lights.
Having a camera for outdoor viewing is a good thing, too.

As opposed to having an alarm that goes beep beep and then calls the cops, or whatever service u have to come and investigate.

Agree 100% that an alarm should not be an end all be all.

Its like the club on your steering wheel. Ive seen dozens of videos where they can be removed in less than a minute. But its the extra minute some a hole needs to take that makes them skip your car and move onto the next. Provided you dont own a honda civic or a full size pickup =)

[RAMd®d]

Its like the club on your steering wheel.


Well, no it's not, not really.

People put Protected byADT and similar stickers on their windows or signs on their lawn.

It's impossible to know how many burglaries or home invasions they've prevented.

Unless there's some form of perimeter security, all most all alarms don't sound until intrusion, be it opening a door, window, or breaking glass.

Very often, by that point a thief is committed. Some run, but a lot don't.

I don't discount the value of an audible alarm, but I don't overestimate it either.

The same with police response, or worse, that of private security.

Both can be very good in limited areas, but a 'ringer' seldom gets priority over just about anything else, especially if a location has had any previous false alarms.

The ability to know and say 'there's someone in the house' changes everything.

Whether or not somebody chooses to have interior video coverage is a personal choice, along with any given solution to do so.

Some people still don't lock their doors and have never had a problem.

People go with what's comfortable for them, and if it works, all's well.

My point is most people put undo faith an an audible alarm and the response it's supposed to trigger.

[macphanatic]

Protecting property and lives is done in layers. Fencing where needed, motion sensing lights, proper installation of doors, locks, windows.

Fencing and lights are first layer. Makes it hard for them to hide. Criminals don't like to be seen.

Reinforce doors. Pull the screws out of your door hinges and strike plates. They're probably 3/4 to 1 inch long. Doesn't take much to make those fail. I replaced at least 2 screws per hinge and both on strike plates with 2-1/2 to 3 inch steel screws (don't use pretty brass ones). Pre drill first. Cheap and easy security upgrade.

On doors with glass, use double dead bolts and take the key out (hang nearby in case of emergency). Not per code, but a huge safety increase. A friend installed the L shaped flip bars that hotels are using. Installed about halfway from the lock to the floor. This significantly improves battering resistance. You'll hear them banging before the alarm goes off.

People are using the same L shaped flip bars for safe rooms, whether its for security or for weather events.

[Michael]

We have a Ring doorbell and a Ring security system. I added a smart lock to the front door that integrates with the Ring system. We sold the motion detector that came with the Ring security system and I bought more sensors for the accessible windows. One reason I chose the Ring was that I was already paying $30 (???) a year for the Ring doorbell and adding the Ring security made the whole thing $100 a year. We use Wyze cams aimed outward at the 4 corners of the house just to see what's going on. I don't have any of the Ring cameras because they're way too expensive for me.

Quite frankly, I think the thing we do that makes it least likely that we'll be robbed is having lights on timers that go on/off at various times. Most people around here just turn off the lights and go away whether it's for the evening or 2 weeks. We also live a mile in on a road that deadends a half mile past us. The one time we saw somebody stealing lumber from a house under construction down the road, I called the owner's dad who lived down the hill from us. He put his truck and a neighbor's truck across the road from ditch to ditch and called the cops. The thieves couldn't get out and were caught by the cops. I'm sort of surprised they didn't try to ram through the trucks across the road!

[rz]

RAMd®d wrote:
I am a fan of motion-activated flood lights.

They don't help much in the middle of the day. Around here, most break-ins occur during the middle of the day, when people aren't home. A block away, two different houses were broken in during the day. The house directly across the street was attempted to be broken into at least twice during the day. One time, a guy was trying to kick in the front door when a neighbor walked over to investigate. Another time, I was home sick and saw a car pull up. The passenger got out while the driver stayed in the car with it running. I walked out my front door with my iPhone's camera rolling. As soon as I walked out, the driver shouted to his passenger, and he jumped back in and they took off.

[RAMd®d]

They don't help much in the middle of the day.


No s, S.

[PeterB]

mattkime wrote:
Its a tradeoff. Some people might be surprised that the footage from their security cameras might be used without their knowledge. A clear alternative is having a system that records locally. Different people will navigate this differently.

I thought about having something that records locally, in fact I had that for awhile in my old apartment. There's no question that cloud storage is better though -- both because you get more capacity and also less likely to lose footage.

As for footage from security cameras being used without my knowledge, I think it extremely unlikely. From the NYT article you linked: "No one at Ring, nor any police department, is allowed to access Ring videos or personal information unless device owners choose to share them via Neighbors." ... and again, at least in my case, if somehow they were to get the footage without my knowledge... it's not anything they couldn't have observed if they were there in person.