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An explanation for us non-US people
#11
"Who asserted this?"

Okay, perhaps asserted was a bad word choice, implied would be better. If we had more than two major political parties, the power of the Democratic and Republican parties would be reduced. In any case, one of the major purposes of political parties is to get candidates of similar ideology elected. They are a necessary evil.

"As opposed to our system, where we have K-Street lobbyists so anxious to curry favor with the party leadership that they allowed a poisonous toad like Grover Norquist tell them who they could hire and how much to pay them.

As opposed to our system, where these lobbyists write position papers -- sometimes even actual legislation-- for elected representatives. Representatives to whom they have been granted unparalleled access as a reward for loyalty to one party or the other."


We will never be rid of people trying to influence politicians as long as we have politicians. I do not see myself as cynical; this is simply human nature. The only true way to reduce the power of politicians is to reduce the amount of money they control. The Libertarian position.

"It is only recently that Senators have been elected by popular vote."

This was not my point; I do not want to see Senators appointed to their positions by state legislatures or Governors. What I meant was that there is precedent for one man not having one vote when we elect Senators. Going by the population ratios in the 2000 election, a voter in Wyoming gets 50 votes for Senator, while someone in California gets one vote. Or to put this another way, A Senator from Wyoming has 50 times the political clout he should have.
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#12
[quote freeradical]
We will never be rid of people trying to influence politicians as long as we have politicians.
As if there was anything wrong with trying to influence your government representative to look out for your own interests?
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#13
[quote freeradical]Okay, perhaps asserted was a bad word choice, implied would be better. If we had more than two major political parties, the power of the Democratic and Republican parties would be reduced.
If you are responding to my post then no. I neither implied nor asserted what you seem to infer.

In any case, one of the major purposes of political parties is to get candidates of similar ideology elected. They are a necessary evil.

George Washington argued otherwise.

The only true way to reduce the power of politicians is to reduce the amount of money they control. The Libertarian position.

An indefensible thesis on its own. Notable, also, in that no one here (save you) seems to be advocating reduced powers for politicians. For my part, I am in favor of a strong federal government, so long as that government is responsive to the people, and not (solely) to the monied interests or to political parties intent on securing and preserving their own hegemony.


What I meant was that there is precedent for one man not having one vote when we elect Senators. Going by the population ratios in the 2000 election, a voter in Wyoming gets 50 votes for Senator, while someone in California gets one vote. Or to put this another way, A Senator from Wyoming has 50 times the political clout he should have.

Again, the bicameral legislature was devised so that the interests of the less populous states would not be ignored. The Senator from Wyoming has exactly the political clout intended by the framers.

The process of electing a president, on the other hand, has endured much tinkering specifically to address the desire of party politicians that the executive fall entirely to one party or another after an election.

What is, I think, puzzling to voodoopenguin is that the popular press in this country behaves as though the President is elected by popular vote, when this is not the case.

Edit -- stupid html tags.
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#14
realistically, you can't ever get down to "one person, one vote"

statistically, there will always be margins of error when we are talking about tens of millions of votes.

remember with the new touchscreen electronic voting, most will not have a receipt or any type of paper trail to go back to individual votes
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#15
Free,

Am I missing something here? Regardless of what they say in the battleground states, it appears politicians are already polarized and do what is in their best interest as well as that of the individuals and companies who’ve given them the most money and/or done them favors. Same goes for their base. In the end, it seems to me the people in our country as a whole tend to be one of the last things on their mind at times.

Maybe modernizing the electoral college or election system may actually make the party system we have work in properly and give politicians the kick in the butt they richly deserve. Right now, it seems like we have a two party system when that’s not the case because the other smaller parties don’t have a fighting chance against the democraps and repubilishits. It’s be nice to see the big two get some competition.

Robert




> If we got rid of the electoral college, the entire
> nature of political campaigns would change as well.
> Right now, candidates are forced to speak to the middle
> in the "battleground" states where the vote is expected
> to be close. This would change if we got rid of the
> electoral college. In my opinion, this would cause our
> politics to become even more polarized as the
> candidates would only be interested in their base.
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#16
[quote Robert M]
Maybe modernizing the electoral college or election system may actually make the party system we have work in properly and give politicians the kick in the butt they richly deserve. Right now, it seems like we have a two party system when that’s not the case because the other smaller parties don’t have a fighting chance against the democraps and repubilishits. It’s be nice to see the big two get some competition.
I agree; it would be nice to see some competition. I'd like to see every politician running for office or reelection in the political fight of their lives. However, I don't see how "fixing" the electoral college will solve this.

I think the real problem is how political districts are gerrymandered. In California, congressional districts really only change hands every ten years, or on a friday the 13th in a leap year when there's a blue moon and a solar eclipse on the same day.

Schwarzenegger was right.
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#17
>I don't see how "fixing" the electoral college will solve this.

If thats the rational, how will not "fixing" something this obsolete help solve anything? Unless you can discern some enormous danger that comes with 'fixing' it, why not just fix it?
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