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Thanksgiving reflections
#1
On this day of thanks it's important to reflect on the true princples which
laid the foundation for America's almost 70-year-old national holiday.
http://www.oyate.org/resources/shortthanks.html
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#2
Black Landlord wrote:
On this day of thanks it's important to reflect on the true princples which
laid the foundation for America's almost 70-year-old national holiday.
http://www.oyate.org/resources/shortthanks.html

Thanks for posting the link. It's amazing how myths are poured into children's
heads and taught as "history" and "truth", here and all around the world, in so many
different ways.

Still, I'll enjoy the Thanksgiving ritual with part of my family tomorrow, even if
it's based on happy-faced bunkum. Plus, my doggies will get turkey leftovers,
and their faces will display thanks with more sincerity and innocence than I can
ever express.
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#3
and still to this day, the USA is nation-building, converting natives to their ways... and if it takes bloodshed, so be it.
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#4
I have always wondered whether some of the myths and rituals that the USA now seem to have developed are down to a desire for its own history. It's all very well that the USA is/was a new, modern forward thinking nation but I have often felt when talking to US friends that there is also a slight jealousy about the European countries much longer history. For example we have so many incredible buildings, magnificent cathedrals that are over 800 years old and the oldest building in the USA is...? Europe, of the last few hundred years of course, also had this jealousy of previous great civilisations, the Greeks, the Egyptians and further afield India and China.
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#5
voodoopenguin wrote:
I have always wondered whether some of the myths and rituals that the USA now seem to have developed are down to a desire for its own history. It's all very well that the USA is/was a new, modern forward thinking nation but I have often felt when talking to US friends that there is also a slight jealousy about the European countries much longer history. For example we have so many incredible buildings, magnificent cathedrals that are over 800 years old and the oldest building in the USA is...? Europe, of the last few hundred years of course, also had this jealousy of previous great civilisations, the Greeks, the Egyptians and further afield India and China.

I see where you're going but I think you may be projecting your awareness of history and its importance onto americans.
I don't think most americans have a sense that the're missing hundreds or thousands of years in their historical sensibility. You can't miss something you never had.
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#6
Black Landlord wrote:

I see where you're going but I think you may be projecting your awareness of history and its importance onto americans.
I don't think most americans have a sense that the're missing hundreds or thousands of years in their historical sensibility. You can't miss something you never had.

I'm not from the US so my thoughts were purely from speaking to US citizens. Of course most of those were visitors to Europe and so had seen first hand the ancient buildings and the rituals and traditions that often go back many hundreds of years.

The phrase 'You can't miss something you never had' is one I have often had trouble with. I remember it from school history lessons 45 years ago as being a reason given at the time for plantation owners not freeing slaves. The slaves were 2nd, 3rd or even 4th generation and so had never known freedom. The emancipationists were told that the slaves didn't miss their freedom as they had never had it so would not know what to do with it.

And before you think that I am getting at the USA I will say that I am talking about our UK history. There is some history that I am not happy to have.
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#7
I don't actually like the "post and run" thing that happens here occasionally, but I have a thought about the focus of this thread that I'd like to share, although I know I won't have time to participate if it goes much further. So, I offer my apologies in advance for posting and then having to disappear to tend to my turkey and trimmings!

I'm a second generation citizen of this country, so it was somebody else's ancestors that had already done the conquering of this land long before my family got here. However, while those from England were here tormenting the Native Americans and stealing their land, my ancestors were being tormented by conquerors in another part of the world and having their land stolen. This is simply the history of the world folks. Please don't misunderstand; I certainly don't feel the Native Americans were treated well, and, in some parts of this country, they still aren't being treated well. But those "Pilgrims" who came here in the early 1600s and established their settlement didn't write the book on the subject of taking over land at the expense of those who were there first. Sadly, it continues today in other parts of the world.

Personally, I have kind of "rewritten" the reason for this celebration in my own mind. It's the day of the year that I pay tribute to those things for which I am thankful - my family and friends most especially.
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#8
Alpha, that's a good point. Sad, but true. And I would add there are still people in this world who would take _our_ land, without a bit of remorse. It's a brutal world, period. We probably just happen to be in a small pocket of history where it doesn't seem so to us.

I think there are people in the U.S. who are envious of the history of other countries. But I think most just appreciate what other countries have, as well as appreciating what we have. I guess some don't appreciate anything Wink . I thank God for what we have, and pray that others be blessed too. kj.
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#9
Odd, I usually hear it as being the other wayaround.


If the Indians had brought the Pilgrims a donkey instead of a turkey, we'd all be getting a piece of ass.
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#10
billb wrote:
Odd, I usually hear it as being the other wayaround.


If the Indians had brought the Pilgrims a donkey instead of a turkey, we'd all be getting a piece of ass.

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