04-14-2014, 12:23 PM
No, it is probably the same guy, it only means what it means, it is just one episode in the propaganda wars, but it does not validate the rest of the propaganda in the article.
You dont get it, cbelt, I do not need to listen to Putin, I do not because I presume it to be propaganda.
On the other hand just because a fact is brought by a Ukrainian propagandist does not negate its factuality, neither does Putin's arguments can be automatically dismissed because they are brought up by Putin. In fact, it is American scientific research that documents the Ukrainian nazi revisionism of history that we accepted during the Cold War and its subsequent underpinnings of Ukrainian statehood and its national ideology. The only difference between the "moderates" and the Ukrainian right is the degree of nationalism and xenophobia. Their disagreement is over the recipe, not the subject of the meal.
Like you know Pakistan I know Ukraine, I know Ukrainians. I know their immediate neighbors and I know the actual history of the area, and I know the propaganda put out by the Ukrainian nazi refugees that permeated our foreign policy during the Cold War.
Last week, in Milan, I spend quite a bit of time in our annual meetings with some of the Ukraine's neighbors, most of these people I have known for over twenty years and our discussions are quite frank, especially when it comes to politics. We have common comprehension of the region's history and the Big Picture. We have a totally different starting point to our discussions than I have here. They are not subject to our's or Putin's propaganda. They have no illusions about Obama's naivete and his incompetence in foreign policy, or the ubiquity of the Ukrainian nazism. They, also, are quite wary of Putin's expansionism, more so than any American can comprehend. But they are also very wary of the potential for the situation to escalate to a major conflict they do not want.
The old Cold War diplomats with deep background knowledge of parties involved, like Kissinger or Matlock, actually get it. Unlike the present regime, they have solutions that agree with those I heard in my conversations. Finnlandization of Ukraine is one of them.
There are reasonable solutions if you do not buy into the propaganda, cbelt....
Now I am off to your ancestral neighborhood, Hungary...
You dont get it, cbelt, I do not need to listen to Putin, I do not because I presume it to be propaganda.
On the other hand just because a fact is brought by a Ukrainian propagandist does not negate its factuality, neither does Putin's arguments can be automatically dismissed because they are brought up by Putin. In fact, it is American scientific research that documents the Ukrainian nazi revisionism of history that we accepted during the Cold War and its subsequent underpinnings of Ukrainian statehood and its national ideology. The only difference between the "moderates" and the Ukrainian right is the degree of nationalism and xenophobia. Their disagreement is over the recipe, not the subject of the meal.
Like you know Pakistan I know Ukraine, I know Ukrainians. I know their immediate neighbors and I know the actual history of the area, and I know the propaganda put out by the Ukrainian nazi refugees that permeated our foreign policy during the Cold War.
Last week, in Milan, I spend quite a bit of time in our annual meetings with some of the Ukraine's neighbors, most of these people I have known for over twenty years and our discussions are quite frank, especially when it comes to politics. We have common comprehension of the region's history and the Big Picture. We have a totally different starting point to our discussions than I have here. They are not subject to our's or Putin's propaganda. They have no illusions about Obama's naivete and his incompetence in foreign policy, or the ubiquity of the Ukrainian nazism. They, also, are quite wary of Putin's expansionism, more so than any American can comprehend. But they are also very wary of the potential for the situation to escalate to a major conflict they do not want.
The old Cold War diplomats with deep background knowledge of parties involved, like Kissinger or Matlock, actually get it. Unlike the present regime, they have solutions that agree with those I heard in my conversations. Finnlandization of Ukraine is one of them.
There are reasonable solutions if you do not buy into the propaganda, cbelt....
Now I am off to your ancestral neighborhood, Hungary...