EV charging at the Mall

[Forrest]

I like my hybrid.

I saw a utility company owned BPHEV vehicle in the area yesterday. The charging door was permanently taped closed with a sticker saying DO NOT CHARGE!

I can only speculate the 10% ethanol gas went bad because drivers were charging all the time.

[graylocks]

Forrest wrote:
I can only speculate the 10% ethanol gas went bad because drivers were charging all the time.

don't know about other plug-in hybrid but the Volt was engineered to prevent this. If your gas aged to a year the engine entered Fuel Maintenance Mode to burn off the gasoline. I don't think my new Niro has that. Maybe because the electric range is only 31 miles; there's no way to not use gas.

[Markintosh]

As an EV owner for almost 5 years, I have some real answers rather than baseless guesses:

1) If you are a potential EV owner, one of the first rules is that any mall is generally not the place you want to charge. It's where you will see the worst of EV charging behaviors: people just leaving their car on the charger while they shop in the mall, costs be damned as they have money. It's also the most likely place where someone might park their ICE car in a charger space because they can't find another close in spot. Also malls are crowded, generally attracting far more visitors than the EV infrastructure can handle.

2) Second to malls, EV chargers at Target and Walmart get similarly abused.

3) Usually the best EV chargers are in grocery store parking lots, the back of a gas station, banks or a purpose built place akin to an EV gas station. The time people spend in those places is usually based on their estimated charging time.

4) Home is the best place to charge you EV.

5) There are a half dozen apps out there that let you know ahead of time what to expect as far as availability. It's even built into the software of the Ioniq 5. If I navigate to a charger, the screen will show me how many chargers are currently available. It's easy to select an alternative if things look busy.

Buy the EV. Your planet will thank you.

[graylocks]

Markintosh wrote:
2) Second to malls, EV chargers at Target and Walmart get similarly abused.

Oh, to live in a land where there are chargers at Walmart. NEVER seen that in the South. The Costco that opened up near me a few years ago has chargers but I don't think others in the ATL metro area do. The Whole Food budget store (forget what it's actually called) has chargers also.

[DinerDave]

Forrest wrote:
I like my hybrid.

I saw a utility company owned BPHEV vehicle in the area yesterday. The charging door was permanently taped closed with a sticker saying DO NOT CHARGE!

I can only speculate the 10% ethanol gas went bad because drivers were charging all the time.

That sounds odd to me. The Chevy Volt was programmed to force the ICE to run at least once every 30 days to keep "the juices flowing" and maintain the system. The fuel tank was sealed a lot better than normal cars to keep air and moisture out. Had a 10 second (?) delay to open the fuel tank as it equalized the pressure.

Dave

[special]

4) Home is the best place to charge you EV.

That should be #1 IMHO.

In 7 year of Volt ownership, besides free charing at work, we charged once at the mall, once at a restaurant and I think that was it. I can't recall any other situation.

[DinerDave]

I get that not everyone's living situation is suitable for EV charging. This is how I was able to get my 2023 Bolt EUV Premier Redline. Owner had 14 months, put on only 4,200 miles and was tired of only public chargers. Seems he lived in a complex that had no way to charge. Not sure why if garaged, it couldn't be plugged in, but whatever. The portable 110/220 V charger from the factory was still sealed and never used. So he sold it, I just happened to see it and bought it. I put on 16,000 miles in 13 months so far.
I installed a 220 line outside my garage, wife's car gets garage, and probably 99% of my charging is done at home. Only public pay for charging I've used is when we went to Virginia, and to Cape Cod.

The other point I want to make is that the biggest argument I hear is range. It is true that my Bolt has about 250 miles of range, and my wife's Crosstrek will do about 475. We will decide on longer day trips do we have good charging at the destination, or do we not want to deal with that and use the Crosstrek. Overnight, no problem, as we will have time to deal with a charge.
Example, Cape Cod is about 175 miles each way, plus riding around, we know several reliable chargers to use on that route, so the Bolt it is. Another trip we do is to the Kennebunk Maine area, less choices there, so we will take the Crosstrek.

It just takes a little forethought and planning.
All the other days of the year, we enjoy not paying for gas.

Dave

[Speedy]

graylocks wrote:
[quote=Forrest]
I can only speculate the 10% ethanol gas went bad because drivers were charging all the time.

don't know about other plug-in hybrid but the Volt was engineered to prevent this. If your gas aged to a year the engine entered Fuel Maintenance Mode to burn off the gasoline. I don't think my new Niro has that. Maybe because the electric range is only 31 miles; there's no way to not use gas.
I believe the Volt must only burn one tank of fuel a year. As DinerDave mentions, the fuel system is designed to handle 10% ethanol including a stainless steel gas tank and all the fuel lines as well as having a system to take care of condensation forming in the tank. We just came back from over-wintering in south Texas and our Volt, which sat for six months, started but required we burn off the some of the remains of the gas. (I use a battery maintainer on the 12v battery.) I had left only a gallon in the tank and I refueled it right away which, it seems, satisfied the computer. We will no doubt burn eight gallons of the nine gallon capacity tank off before we leave again at the end of October even if I have to force the ICE generator to run.

[Speedy]

Robert M wrote:
Speedy,

That's incredibly easy to say but, for many people, it isn't an option. You need to live in the real world where people don't necessarily have the luxury of charging an EV at home or at an office. I very fortunate. I can install the charging station in my warehouse since I own the company. Other people aren't so lucky.

Like pqrst, the building where I reside lacks the infrastructure for electric vehicle charging solutions without a significant expense and agita. Many other issues are much higher priority and must be taken care of before charging solutions become a consideration, let alone a reality. Offering charging stations for our residents isn't going to happen anytime soon. Heck, I;'d be astonished if the building installs charging solutions for residents anytime in the near future. More likely, my family will be long gone from the building by the time charging solutions are in place.

Robert

"Simple. Charge at work and you’ll be fine unless you drive 300+ miles a day in which case take an ICE vehicle. I suppose you let the shop that does your maintenance come pick up and drop off your vehicle at your office thus not costing you time, only money; money that you wouldn’t spend if you drove an EV."

You must drive a great distance to not be able to recharge sufficiently during a normal workday because there are cars and EVSEs that can give you nearly 300 miles during a typical workday.. Weekends would be tougher but soon, as the Chinese have demonstrated or claimed, you will be able to fast charge in the same number of minutes as gassing a car. Fueling at a workplace will almost always beat fueling at a gas pump. As C(-)ris mentioned in another thread, plugging in and unplugging takes five seconds each.

Even now most new residential construction doesn’t provide for charging. I imagine in more progressive areas with lots of EVs, demand requires upgraded wiring and the ability to charge. It’s a bit ironic that in the late 60’s, early 70’s I lived in an apartment complex that had 20a outlets in the parking lot to run vehicle engine heaters during our cold winters. These would have been sufficient today for many residents to get enough charge overnight for their usual daily driving needs.

We are having a builder construct a new house for us right now. I specified a 400 Amp panel to handle two 100 Amp EVSEs plus the regular household needs (all electric); future proofing more for the next owner more than what we will ever need at my age (74) and driving needs because we are having 40 and 60 Amp EVSEs installed (I already had the 40 Amp one). But there are continuous 80 Amp EVSEs out there now that require 100 Amp wiring. To my surprise, single family homes are limited to 225 Amp panels so I had two 200 Amp panels installed side by side in our garage (Home Depot, etc. sells 400 Amp panels so I thought I was good when I was pricing but they are for commercial use only).

Our co-op in Texas (Magic Valley) sells electricity at 8.5¢/kWh but has, IIRC, a $60 monthly fixed charge. Also, you cannot go off-grid with your own solar and batteries, you are required to connect to the grid and pay the $60 + other fees even if you draw zero kWs. Also, they don’t buy excess generation and even if they did it would cost more to install and use solar than to buy this very cheap power from the co-op (special posted a link awhile ago to google.solar that I used to research that I would be in the hole over $40k, and counting, in 20 years if I installed solar).

[Robert M]

Speedy,

That would be true if and only if I have the charging gear at my office. Right now, I don't have it. If I get a plug-in hybrid, I will have to invest in the charging hardware. It would be the only way for a plug-in or electric vehicle would work for me. No need to ask for permission to install the gear because I own the company. If I want the gear, it gets purchased and installed. It's one of the benefits of being in charge.

For the times I can't charge at my office, I'd be forced to use a public charging station. That's an issue for the reasons I mentioned previously. The time it takes to plug and unplug a vehicle is seconds. It's not even relevant to the discussion. The time it takes to recharge the vehicle is a key factor. I've no interest in sitting at a public charging site for 20 minutes or longer charging a vehicle and that isn't factoring in the time spent waiting for an open charging station if it's busy.

Right now, I have a gas-only vehicle. If I spend the bucks on a car, I may as well ensure I have both options available to me.

Robert