Diesel Honda Civic Tourer Hits 83.52 MPG

[Mr645]

A lot of the high milage cars sold overseas would never sell here. Americans will not deal with the low power of many of these cars. Example

I just bought a Lexus NX200t which has 235 hp turbo 4 and the biggest complaint from owners is it's underpowered for a 4100b small suv. However in many markets they also offer it with a 175 hp non turbo 4.

[Speedy]

Mr645 wrote:
A lot of the high milage cars sold overseas would never sell here.

Especially if the carmakers never try. Make the car five passenger and it will sell. The Prius would never sell here but it does. The VW Diesels would never sell here but they sold at an amazing premium.

I don't need massive power. All those fools who launch at the light change and brake hard at the next one are usually waiting beside me at the following light. And my torquey VW Diesel can easily pull a 2500 pound loaded trailer. As can an even torquier electric.

[silvarios]

p8712 wrote:

Me three. Just saw one still driving on the local roads. Real world MPG was likely closer to 45-50, but not too bad.

Yeah, with a CVT. With a stick, you'll break 70, maybe 80.

That's very likely true. I can't drive a manual transmission. My mom tried to teach me, but I couldn't grok reverse. Then again, all these years later and she doesn't drive a stick anymore. Something like 90% of cars sold are automatic. I took the long view.

That's still pretty darn awesome.

[Bill in NC]

Needs either a regenerative system or (most OEMs) DEF injection to convert the NOx to water & nitrogen.

More expense, higher maintenance.

Filliam H. Muffman wrote:
A lean burn gas engine should only need the same tweaks that they made to diesels. Triple catalyst and DGI are what many manufacturers are working towards, if they aren't already there.

[quote=Bill in NC]
Lean-burn engine?

Can't sell those here anymore either, they run afoul of the same strict NOx emissions limits that doom most diesel engines.

[quote=Filliam H. Muffman]
The 1992 Honda Civic VX was rated for 49 MPG, but it weighed about 900 lbs less then the current one. Lots of people said they got over 50 MPG and one hyper-miler got 70 MPG averaging 3 fill ups.

Looking at the US lineup of Honda, you wouldn't know they made diesel engines. I wonder if they will start selling them here when the new fleet mileage rules get closer to the implementation date.

[Mr645]

The VW diesels area good mix of power and efficiency. VW uses the 150 and 170hp turbo diesels and they are actually quite responsive. But they don't bring the 110hp non turbo engines to America because few people would by them. Low powered cars like the Smart, Mazda 2 and a few others are slow sellers and are sold are low to no profit to increase both market share and help brands meet average MPG requirements so the can sell larger, more powerful, less efficient cars and trucks and make money.

GM does not make anything on the Spark, Volt and Sonic, but these cars allow them to sell full size trucks where they make big profits from.

[silvarios]

Supposedly the new 2015 2016 Mazda 2 is going to have a nice bump in MPG.

[Speedy]

Mr645 wrote:
The VW diesels area good mix of power and efficiency. VW uses the 150 and 170hp turbo diesels and they are actually quite responsive. But they don't bring the 110hp non turbo engines to America because few people would by them. Low powered cars like the Smart, Mazda 2 and a few others are slow sellers and are sold are low to no profit to increase both market share and help brands meet average MPG requirements so the can sell larger, more powerful, less efficient cars and trucks and make money.

GM does not make anything on the Spark, Volt and Sonic, but these cars allow them to sell full size trucks where they make big profits from.

Yes, the big cars cost little more to manufacture than the small ones but create all the profit. And that's fine with me.

[deckeda]

Diesels' popularity is related to fuel cost (higher or lower, taxes and subsidies influence greatly) and consumer exposure. GM's example 35 years ago demonstrated people will buy them when offered. They might even have become popular if they were good. Benz has remained a keeper of the flame but for most of us, VW is really the only brand of (relatively affordable) relevance there. Most Americans would never guess that all makers have extensive modern experience making diesels.

Isn't there a Jeep diesel here now? Thought I'd read a diesel Mazda is coming too.

[Racer X]

Mr645 wrote:
The VW diesels area good mix of power and efficiency. VW uses the 150 and 170hp turbo diesels and they are actually quite responsive. But they don't bring the 110hp non turbo engines to America because few people would by them. Low powered cars like the Smart, Mazda 2 and a few others are slow sellers and are sold are low to no profit to increase both market share and help brands meet average MPG requirements so the can sell larger, more powerful, less efficient cars and trucks and make money.

GM does not make anything on the Spark, Volt and Sonic, but these cars allow them to sell full size trucks where they make big profits from.

That's why GM ceated the Geo line, to sell fuel effecient tiny cars from Asia to raise their CAFE numbers.

[silvarios]

Racer X wrote:
That's why GM ceated the Geo line, to sell fuel effecient tiny cars from Asia to raise their CAFE numbers.

Yep. Loved my Geo Prizm, which was cheaper than the comparable used Corollas when I went shopping in 1997. Apparently the Prizm line lost it's resale value after being rebadged as a Chevrolet. Before, the Geo was a little cheaper, because Toyota had more cachet than Geo, but the Chevrolet models were an even better deal (for the used market buyer). To clarify, my Prizm was a 1994 Geo badged model.