Today's school shooting (same one as immediately above)

[DeusxMac]

Lemon Drop wrote:
Speaking as a person with over 30 years of experience advocating for gun responsibility, I really hope none of you has people including children murdered who are close to you. Then the first thing you're supposed to say to anyone is something political about gun control. Don't you dare grieve or ask for comfort!

Praying is a strong emotional comfort for many people when they are grieving or in any form of distress. Knowing others are including you in prayer is also a comfort.

If you can't be kind, then leave them alone, and do the politics yourself.

"The Lord works in mysterious ways."

"It's God's will."

"It must have been their time."

"They're in a better place now."

Recite platitude. Dig hole. Insert head.

[Lux Interior]

I'm not ridiculing the victims nor their families.

I'm ridiculing the politicians who tweet out their thoughts & prayers, then make comments like "This is because the liberals have kicked god out of school!" (quite ironic in this case). Or blame video games. Anything other than the easy accessibility to firearms. And then vote against any thing that might hinder accessibility to guns. Or pass laws forbidding your pediatrician to ask about firearms.

I have no issues with leaning on your beliefs in seeking comfort.



And venting about it in threads like this is part of the therapy for me in releasing my frustrations.

[Lemon Drop]

Lux Interior wrote:
I'm not ridiculing the victims nor their families.

I'm ridiculing the politicians who tweet out their thoughts & prayers, then make comments like "This is because the liberals have kicked god out of school!" (quite ironic in this case). Or blame video games. Anything other than the easy accessibility to firearms. And then vote against any thing that might hinder accessibility to guns. Or pass laws forbidding your pediatrician to ask about firearms.

I have no issues with leaning on your beliefs in seeking comfort.



And venting about it in threads like this is part of the therapy for me in releasing my frustrations.

Understood.

I'm responding to this. It appeared that the comments critical of praying were directed at this Mom.

"They interviewed the mom of one of the kids at this school and asked her “What do you do [in this situation]?” and she said “Pray” - “God is good, God is gracious”.

[kj]

Lemon Drop wrote:
[quote=Lux Interior]
I'm not ridiculing the victims nor their families.

I'm ridiculing the politicians who tweet out their thoughts & prayers, then make comments like "This is because the liberals have kicked god out of school!" (quite ironic in this case). Or blame video games. Anything other than the easy accessibility to firearms. And then vote against any thing that might hinder accessibility to guns. Or pass laws forbidding your pediatrician to ask about firearms.

I have no issues with leaning on your beliefs in seeking comfort.



And venting about it in threads like this is part of the therapy for me in releasing my frustrations.

Understood.

I'm responding to this. It appeared that the comments critical of praying were directed at this Mom.

"They interviewed the mom of one of the kids at this school and asked her “What do you do [in this situation]?” and she said “Pray” - “God is good, God is gracious”.
Exactly, they aren’t in a place where political activism is going to help them, or even be an appropriate response. Perhaps in the future, but right now, support and prayer are what they’ve got.

I’m not sure we know exactly how to fix our problems, but I’ll just say I know we can do a lot better. To address further the criticism, people who pray do a frick load of active things to change the world. I’ll back that up with data if need be (but seriously?).

The assumption that they are all gun nuts is ridiculous. There is a fair amount of diversity in the kids who attend that school, and I’m guessing many vote democrat and/or are very reasonable about gun issues.

[Lemon Drop]

"The assumption that they are all gun nuts is ridiculous. There is a fair amount of diversity in the kids who attend that school, and I’m guessing many vote democrat and/or are very reasonable about gun issues."

I don't think anyone here made that assumption, I haven't seen that anywhere.

But I agree on the other points.

[kj]

Lemon Drop wrote:
"The assumption that they are all gun nuts is ridiculous. There is a fair amount of diversity in the kids who attend that school, and I’m guessing many vote democrat and/or are very reasonable about gun issues."

I don't think anyone here made that assumption, I haven't seen that anywhere.

But I agree on the other points.

Yeah, I have to admit it's just a feeling I get that they are low key being blamed for getting what's coming to them when people post stuff about "God, guns, gravy and grits". To me it's implied, but I could be wrong. I understand they could just be blaming the people responsible for our gun situation, but I don't completely buy it.

[pdq]

So, thought experiment.

What if a state removed all limits on drinking and driving, and fatal accidents involving cars soared? And one plowed into a school bus, killing kids (which had happened over and over), what would be your response?

Would it be thoughts and prayers? “God is good and gracious”? Would it be Alcohol is not the problem; people are?

If someone raised their voice and said This is ridiculous! Why do we, the only state where this happens regularly, put up with this? We need to do something! - would you accuse them of politicizing tragedy?

[Lemon Drop]

Pdq,
Criticizing a grieving mother for praying when her community has just experienced the trauma of a child murdering another child and a teacher is being a righteous jerk.

She doesn't need to say a damn word to please YOU OR ANYONE ELSE.

You didn't quote a politician, you quoted and mocked and criticized a grieving mother. Shame on you.

The political work of reducing gun violence is up to all of US, don't lay it on the victims.

[pdq]

Just to be clear, this was a mom of a kid at the school who was fine.

I don’t understand why you think I’m “mocking” her - a reporter asked her what can be done about these things (or that’s the way I interpreted it when I saw it), and her only answer was “pray”.

And I said prayers aren’t solving this problem. I’m sorry if that offends you, but it’s objectively true.

You know, I often time hear people (usually conservatives) loudly complain about things being “shoved down our throats” by liberals, and I have a tough time with that accusation and expression. Apart from geese about to become fois gras, I think the expression is coarse, and unwarranted.

You want to solve societal problems by praying, go for it! Pray all day and night. But when you do, don’t be like the Pharisees, who love to pray standing on the street corners and in front of television cameras to be seen by men. I won’t shove my religious beliefs at you, and I hope you can understand when I expect the same in return.

And don’t take offense when others suggest other solutions that might, just might, be more effective.

[Lemon Drop]

"Watching the local news, I’ve heard “prayer” so many times - soo many times. They interviewed the mom of one of the kids at this school and asked her “What do you do [in this situation]?” and she said “Pray” - “God is good, God is gracious”.

We have a context problem here.

Her "situation" is one of immediate trauma and grief. She's not "fine" and neither are her kids. This is trauma that never goes away. Ask any survivor of a school shooting. And everyone on that campus is a survivor now and forever.

She is not at a townhall or city council meeting being asked what she thinks should be done about gun violence. I've never heard anyone in that context say "all anyone should do is pray."

And yes, this criticizing by liberals of people who pray as a comfort to grief is extremely unhelpful to any liberal cause. It turns people off so much and makes them feel disrespected. They won't listen to anything else you have to say.

If prayer bothers you so much then try to ignore it.

This Mom's response has nothing to do with the fight for common sense gun legislation. Leave the victims alone to grieve.