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RgrF wrote:
I have yet to read the story but feel a need to comment on this application of "situational ethics" by someone who espouses a different sort of ethic for others. If you were a surgeon and faced with either hospital or legal prerequisites that forbade your participating in an operation which might actually save a patient, would you circumvent those procedures and go forward with what you know in you heart is right, or would you stand down and let the patient take his/her chances?
For this and many similar scenarios, reruns of "House M.D." are on the USA Network in 3-hour blocks 5 nights a week.
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Ah! Again I missed my calling. I should have been a Hollywood screenwriter? (sorry I don't watch much TV)
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cbelt3 wrote:
Hospitals are supposed to restrict visitors when the patient's health is at risk from the visitors. When a patient is dying, they're supposed to open up the doors.
Hospital worker here. Not sure where you're getting this.
Hospitals make decisions based on legalities and liabilities.
In this particular case it might have been illegal under state law to give access to this family (I don't have enough details to know) but even so with the facts presented any risk manager should have been able to see that they could prove they acted appropriately if visitation was allowed, if necessary.
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The fact is she had 'power of attorney'. The hospital would not dare keep an actual attorney from their client and that they kept the 'attorney" of record from seeing her makes them culpable for damages. Let them pay the price for their opinions.
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June '08 article wrote:
Federal health privacy laws say hospitals should not disclose details about a patient except to the nearest family member or someone with power of attorney. Hospitals legally do not have to allow visitors.
Florida law spells out a priority list for who doctors should consult about a patient's health care: first, a guardian or health surrogate, then a spouse, adult child, parent, adult sibling, adult relative and finally a close friend.
Normally, hospitals honor a power of attorney but there could be legal or logistical reasons that would interfere, said William Bell, attorney for the Florida Hospital Association.
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RgrF wrote:
The fact is she had 'power of attorney'. The hospital would not dare keep an actual attorney from their client and that they kept the 'attorney" of record from seeing her makes them culpable for damages. Let them pay the price for their opinions.
"Power of attorney" is a term of art.
It's not the equivalent of being someone's attorney.
Power of attorney means only that you have the authority to act on someone's behalf in a legal proceeding.
In this case, the surviving partner had the legal authority to authorize medical decisions for the decedent. It's not clear whether that included visitation.
With such imbeciles working at that hospital, even an attorney might have had to get a writ for visitation under those circumstances.
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Additionally, Power of Attorney is not always attained in ethical ways.
Plenty of greedy people manage to get PoA over monied relatives without giving a rat's ass about the relative's welfare (or worse . . .);
would you want such a person at the dieing one's side barking orders at the doctors?
Again, there are details missing here, so the above is not in reference to the Florida case.
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Black wrote:
Additionally, Power of Attorney is not always attained in ethical ways.
Plenty of greedy people manage to get PoA over monied relatives without giving a rat's ass about the relative's welfare (or worse . . .);
would you want such a person at the dieing one's side barking orders at the doctors?
You've seen too many soap operas.
The overwhelming majority of health care proxies are certainly not obtained under false pretenses and acting as if each one was presumptively obtained by fraud would defeat the purpose of such documents.
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Doc wrote:
[quote=Black]
Additionally, Power of Attorney is not always attained in ethical ways.
Plenty of greedy people manage to get PoA over monied relatives without giving a rat's ass about the relative's welfare (or worse . . .);
would you want such a person at the dieing one's side barking orders at the doctors?
You've seen too many soap operas.
The overwhelming majority of health care proxies are certainly not obtained under false pretenses and acting as if each one was presumptively obtained by fraud would defeat the purpose of such documents.
I don't watch soap operas.
I'm basing my opinion on real, first hand situations I've been party to over the years.
In no way did I suggest that PoAs obtained unethically were the norm, or more than a minority of cases.
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RgrF wrote:
[quote=kj]
I don't find that funny at all. The hospital definitely should have let the lady visit. One thing though, is that I have been to hospitals to visit clients (some who were dying), and when they asked if I was family I said yes. At least after the first time I was denied visitation. kj.
I have yet to read the story but feel a need to comment on this application of "situational ethics" by someone who espouses a different sort of ethic for others. If you were a surgeon and faced with either hospital or legal prerequisites that forbade your participating in an operation which might actually save a patient, would you circumvent those procedures and go forward with what you know in you heart is right, or would you stand down and let the patient take his/her chances?
I've always thought there is often a right and wrong that transcends rules or laws. For myself and others. That doesn't mean everything people do is "right for them". If you think I did something wrong, I'd be happy to discuss it. It's not offensive to me.
Doc, I don't think BL said the majority are fraud. But you'd be surprised how often a POA does not have the person's best interests at heart. Does it say she was POA for health care? There is also POA for financial matters, etc. Also, I've seen scenarios where people are real trouble-makers. I'm not saying she shouldn't have been in there, just that there may have been somewhat of a feud going on (I've seen it happen a lot), which might make it more understandable. kj.
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