Another ignored mass shooting

[Mr645]

sekker wrote:
[quote=Mr645]
yer ignore 4 in Alabama, 3 in Arizona, 3 in Arkansas,

15 mass shootings in California so far this year

Yes.

And for years, the average murder rate in Baltimore was more than 1/day.

And yet, you keep arguing against ANY approaches to fix this.
you don't read too many of my posts, huh. I am strongly in favor of fixing the violent crime problem in this country. Step 1 is to recognize the problem.
I feel we need to step up police support, not defund police, I feel we need to provide better economic opportunities and better education in low income areas, like Trump Economic opportunity Zones program. And we need to keep violent criminals in jail, no more cashless bail or income based bail for violent offenders. Banning pistol stocks or AR-15s won't make any difference

[pdq]

We recognize the problem. Too many guns.

BTW, I count 52 separate stories in my Google News page about this "ignored" shooting.

[Tiangou]

Mr645 wrote:
I feel we need to step up police support, not defund police...

It's a common misperception that police are there to protect people.

In fact, they have no duty of care, and are protected by (un)qualified immunity for nearly any action they take or do not take.

Giving cops more resources invites more abuses, not greater protection for the public.

[Tiangou]

Mr645 wrote: And we need to keep violent criminals in jail, no more cashless bail or income based bail for violent offenders.

There's no evidence that jailing every violent offender for life will reduce crime.

And using "violent" as the standard is ridiculously broad. In most jurisdictions, not immediately obeying a cop's order is a form of "assaulting an officer." A "violent" crime accusation typically used to put peaceful protesters and reporters and random bystanders of color behind bars.

Is there any policy that you support that isn't coding for a violent fascist autocracy?

[Tiangou]

Mr645 wrote: Trump Economic opportunity Zones...

Used to steal homes -- the only form of generation wealth that many people have -- from minorities in poor neighborhoods and redistribute their assets to large investment firms to use for rental properties and strip malls, ensuring that future generations will be poorer and have fewer opportunities for advancement than their parents.

[Ca Bob]

Getting rid of guns is the obvious and effective remedy that would reduce the number of shootings as well as mass shootings. It would also reduce suicides somewhat.

[sekker]

Mr645 wrote:
[quote=sekker]
[quote=Mr645]
yer ignore 4 in Alabama, 3 in Arizona, 3 in Arkansas,

15 mass shootings in California so far this year

Yes.

And for years, the average murder rate in Baltimore was more than 1/day.

And yet, you keep arguing against ANY approaches to fix this.
you don't read too many of my posts, huh. I am strongly in favor of fixing the violent crime problem in this country. Step 1 is to recognize the problem.
I feel we need to step up police support, not defund police, I feel we need to provide better economic opportunities and better education in low income areas, like Trump Economic opportunity Zones program. And we need to keep violent criminals in jail, no more cashless bail or income based bail for violent offenders. Banning pistol stocks or AR-15s won't make any difference
No, I DO read your posts. You follow the NRA playbook, by the letter.

As for police - if you want to make a difference, end police unions. They do NOT make us safer.

https://www.npr.org/transcripts/871298161

I really DO try to cite legitimate, scientific sources for the ideas I promote here.

[Mr645]

From Portland to NYC, places that cut police funding and restricted their actions resulted in increases in crime

[Tiangou]

Mr645 wrote:
From Portland to NYC, places that cut price funding and restricted their actions resulted in increases in crime

::: Sigh :::

Fact check: No evidence defunding police to blame for homicide increases, experts say

A March 2019 study published in the peer-reviewed journal Criminology & Public Policy analyzed the effect of de-policing on homicide rates. In 53 large cities from 2010-2015, researchers found "no evidence of an effect of arrest rates on city homicide rates for any offense category for any year in this period."

"The results of our analysis reveal that declining rates of arrest did not produce the rise in homicide levels," the study authors wrote.

Experts told USA TODAY there are several plausible explanations for the recent spike in homicide rates.

"The pandemic created significant strain, stress and uncertainty – especially in the most vulnerable neighborhoods," Novak said. "George Floyd – and other events – created a legitimacy crisis between people and the police."

During the coronavirus pandemic, more Americans purchased guns, which Kubrin said can escalate a non-lethal crime to a homicide. And police departments nationwide are understaffed – a problem that predates both the pandemic and recent calls to defund the police.

We Analyzed 29 Years of Police Spending in Hundreds of Cities
Here’s what we learned...

The purported goal of all this police spending is to reduce violent crime. New York City Mayor Eric Adams, for example, pledged to double the already considerable number of police patrolling the city’s subway stations following a shooting on the subway in Brooklyn. Earlier this year Adams said he planned to cut funding to most city departments except the NYPD.

But the crime-control benefits of additional policing are unclear. Some studies find that additional police officers—the lion share of any police budget—have no impact on violent crime, while others find they decrease it. Amid this uncertainty, some cities are exploring other, nonpolice efforts to reduce serious crime like violence interrupters, mental health responders, and cash transfers. These approaches are promising but have received only a fraction of the municipal and federal spending the criminal legal system has.

A new study out Thursday suggests all the new police budget growth is likely to do one thing: increase misdemeanor arrests.

For the study, my co-authors and I analyzed hundreds of U.S. cities and towns over 29 years, tracking how police spending and staffing correlated with misdemeanor arrests. We found the size of a city’s police budget and the size of its police force both strongly predicted how many arrests its officers made for things like loitering, trespassing, and drug possession.

The trend was clear: When cities decreased the size of their police departments, they saw fewer misdemeanor arrests and when they increased them, they saw more.

...Arrests for petty offenses are devastating for the people arrested and their communities. Even a single arrest makes a person less likely to stay in school school, be hired for a job, or obtain housing. The punishment of an arrest often cascades into fines, fees, and what legal scholar Issa Kohler-Hausmann calls “procedural hassles,” even in cases that do not result in jail time.

As with many policing outcomes, misdemeanor enforcement is concentrated in poor neighborhoods and in communities of color, exacerbating the racial inequity of their harms. In high-arrest neighborhoods, police officers also have a harder time investigating violent crimes because residents have grown distrustful of the criminal legal system and are less likely to cooperate in investigations.

If intense misdemeanor enforcement reduced crime, these costs might have to be balanced against the public safety benefits of low-level arrests, but study after study has found intense misdemeanor enforcement does not reduce crime...

[Mr645]

Tiangou wrote:
[quote=Mr645]
From Portland to NYC, places that cut price funding and restricted their actions resulted in increases in crime

::: Sigh :::

Fact check: No evidence defunding police to blame for homicide increases, experts say Why are these cities now Refunding police budgets?

A March 2019 study published in the peer-reviewed journal Criminology & Public Policy analyzed the effect of de-policing on homicide rates. In 53 large cities from 2010-2015, researchers found "no evidence of an effect of arrest rates on city homicide rates for any offense category for any year in this period."

"The results of our analysis reveal that declining rates of arrest did not produce the rise in homicide levels," the study authors wrote.

Experts told USA TODAY there are several plausible explanations for the recent spike in homicide rates.

"The pandemic created significant strain, stress and uncertainty – especially in the most vulnerable neighborhoods," Novak said. "George Floyd – and other events – created a legitimacy crisis between people and the police."

During the coronavirus pandemic, more Americans purchased guns, which Kubrin said can escalate a non-lethal crime to a homicide. And police departments nationwide are understaffed – a problem that predates both the pandemic and recent calls to defund the police.

We Analyzed 29 Years of Police Spending in Hundreds of Cities
Here’s what we learned...

The purported goal of all this police spending is to reduce violent crime. New York City Mayor Eric Adams, for example, pledged to double the already considerable number of police patrolling the city’s subway stations following a shooting on the subway in Brooklyn. Earlier this year Adams said he planned to cut funding to most city departments except the NYPD. hmm, less police equal more crime, solution? More police

But the crime-control benefits of additional policing are unclear. Some studies find that additional police officers—the lion share of any police budget—have no impact on violent crime, while others find they decrease it. Amid this uncertainty, some cities are exploring other, nonpolice efforts to reduce serious crime like violence interrupters, mental health responders, and cash transfers. These approaches are promising but have received only a fraction of the municipal and federal spending the criminal legal system has.

A new study out Thursday suggests all the new police budget growth is likely to do one thing: increase misdemeanor arrests.

For the study, my co-authors and I analyzed hundreds of U.S. cities and towns over 29 years, tracking how police spending and staffing correlated with misdemeanor arrests. We found the size of a city’s police budget and the size of its police force both strongly predicted how many arrests its officers made for things like loitering, trespassing, and drug possession. so make drugs legal? Ignore petty crimes until the criminals become more brazen? Just look at shoplifting in California. A lot of it is being ignored, so retailers leave, causing further economic hardship on the communities .

The trend was clear: When cities decreased the size of their police departments, they saw fewer misdemeanor arrests and when they increased them, they saw more.

...Arrests for petty offenses are devastating for the people arrested and their communities. Even a single arrest makes a person less likely to stay in school school, be hired for a job, or obtain housing. The punishment of an arrest often cascades into fines, fees, and what legal scholar Issa Kohler-Hausmann calls “procedural hassles,” even in cases that do not result in jail time.

As with many policing outcomes, misdemeanor enforcement is concentrated in poor neighborhoods and in communities of color, exacerbating the racial inequity of their harms. In high-arrest neighborhoods, police officers also have a harder time investigating violent crimes because residents have grown distrustful of the criminal legal system and are less likely to cooperate in investigations.Don't commit crimes. Look at inner city Chicago, New Orleans, washington DC, drugs, gangs, crime are taking over, or have been for decades.

If intense misdemeanor enforcement reduced crime, these costs might have to be balanced against the public safety benefits of low-level arrests, but study after study has found intense misdemeanor enforcement does not reduce crime...