Going for Green - but special interest road-blocks

[davester]

That would be like all the smog station owners and catalytic converter makers getting up in arms to fight against electric cars.

[Mr Downtown]

Banned in Illinois? They installed them last year in Chicago City Hall. I think they're in some Park District buildings, too.

Chicago's unions have successfully fought for years to forbid PVC piping, on the grounds that it would cause nasty fumes in case of a fire. Because there is no other plastic in the average Chicago building . . .

[AAA]

The Chicago DOGS (hot dogs) cause enough nasty fumes... from experience!! YUM.

[davester]

[quote Mr Downtown]
Chicago's unions have successfully fought for years to forbid PVC piping, on the grounds that it would cause nasty fumes in case of a fire. Because there is no other plastic in the average Chicago building . . .
Hey, isn't that a feature, not a bug. At least the burning/melting plastic piping would release the water onto the fire, unlike copper.

[OWC Larry]

And they are technically illegal.... I am not a fan of Mayor Daily - but have to give him credit for the green stuff. He used his muscle to force those installs. They got some 60 day trial waiver thing... so a gray area... but not surprisingly, once they be in - they be staying.

On the PVC thing - Plenum and other non-PVC alternatives stuff costs A TON MORE and they get a bigger markup too. We had to use Plenum in our facility for a lot of stuff including our network cables.

However - it wasn't because, in our case, that PVC was banned - it had to do with the air return system. In a high efficiency system, if there was a fire and the PVC burned - the air system would very quickly distribute the toxins burning PVC releases throughout the building. Even though we have quite a sprinkler/fire suppression system and the likelihood of a fire is remote regardless, this is the safe way to go. If our air return system was different, we'd not have had the code requirement concerning PVC.

You don't have to be a 'tree hugger' to respect the environment. I see things in a practical way that also considers fair use and what I'll be leaving for my kids.

I will say this - if there is regulation requiring something - at least 75% of the time, it's because some special interest benefited from the regulation and not because it really has a practical benefit to health/safety/environment. There may be an example used to make whatever case for it... but whether that case is really representative or not, whole other story.

It's all about balance.


[quote Mr Downtown]Banned in Illinois? They installed them last year in Chicago City Hall. I think they're in some Park District buildings, too.

Chicago's unions have successfully fought for years to forbid PVC piping, on the grounds that it would cause nasty fumes in case of a fire. Because there is no other plastic in the average Chicago building . . .

[Mike Johnson]

There are some waterless urinals installed at a local marina, and they're fantastic.

Recently an LA Times columnist wrote about how even a traditional urinal would make sense in the home, only to learn just about everybody thought he was crazy. Imagine if he'd suggested waterless urinals!

[raz]

[quote OWC Larry]
I will say this - if there is regulation requiring something - at least 75% of the time, it's because some special interest benefited from the regulation and not because it really has a practical benefit to health/safety/environment.
True, dat

[quote Pittsburgh Post-Gazette]
Not to alarm you, but if Pennsylvania approves a "bottle bill," reimbursing a nickel for each recycled soda bottle or beer can, there's a slight chance that an unholy alliance of Russian mobsters and homeless street urchins might infiltrate the state's recycling infrastructure, rummaging through your blue bags at night and offing the poor saps who should try to collect recyclables in the wrong neighborhoods.

So, you know, keep your eyes peeled for that.

It's one of many warnings, some more apocalyptic than others, being sounded by Giant Eagle, the Pennsylvania Beverage Association and their lobbyists as they gird for a fight against lawmakers who think a 5-cent deposit on soda, water, beer and sports-drink bottles would help promote recycling and reduce litter.
From our local newsrag http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07266/819834-28.stm

[JoeH]

Is that what it takes to get the Russian mob to show up? Wish my state had known that 30+ years ago when bottle and can refunds started being required. o

Seriously though, there is a lot less litter of the can and bottle sort along the roads compared to 35-40 years ago. The bottlers also complained a decade or so later when the state required them to split all the unrefunded deposits with the state, they were extra profit up until then.

[davester]

It's a fact of life that there are vested interests for every position. We just need to keep the wrong ones from getting too much power.

[Seacrest]