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Lemon Drop wrote:
[quote=vision63]
Lots of good stuff that people talk about but as far at priorities go, this is what needs to be focused on.
1. Considering that we're one Senator away from GOP control, holding our ranks in 2022 is paramount. Raphael Warnock's seat in particular is in up for grabs in 22 months.
2. We have to defend the House. We can easily lose House control in 2022. The GOP is going to fight with a ferocity that we've never seen before. If we think we can be cute, we can lose. We need all the voters we can get, including those on the right that dislike their own party.
3. Only elections have saved this country. Not any stump speeches, policy initiatives, investigations or any kind of efforts we tried stopped them. Only turning out the vote and getting their votes counted did the job.
We have to do that job even better. The goal of the GOP is to figure out ways to divide the left and peel off voters.
Yes.
And in the short time between now and 2022 elections, produce meaningful results for people. Things Dems can campaign on. Biden's economic plans can peel off Republicans.
That kinda goes without saying doesn't it? I "know" the Democrats that are currently governing, will do the most they can to legislate the best policy the current conditions can muster. Our job, is to give them the power to do it. If, for example we lose the presidency in 2024 and they undo everything we've accomplished then we've really not done much.
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Lemon Drop wrote: Yes.
And in the short time between now and 2022 elections, produce meaningful results for people. Things Dems can campaign on. Biden's economic plans can peel off Republicans.
To repeat myself somewhat, it's not just important to get those results, but there needs to be some way to counter the propaganda and communicate to the unwashed masses in thrall of the right wing blogosphere that the democrats are the ones providing them with those results. Remember Jimmy Fallon's experiment where he interviewed a bunch of republicans and asked them how they liked the ACA so far and got many positive responses, but then when he asked how they liked the results of Obamacare they all condemned it as a disaster?
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The biggest problem facing this country is what to do with all the stupid people…
Mao had one solution, but it probably wouldn't work well here. LOL
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vision63 wrote:
[quote=Lemon Drop]
[quote=vision63]
Lots of good stuff that people talk about but as far at priorities go, this is what needs to be focused on.
1. Considering that we're one Senator away from GOP control, holding our ranks in 2022 is paramount. Raphael Warnock's seat in particular is in up for grabs in 22 months.
2. We have to defend the House. We can easily lose House control in 2022. The GOP is going to fight with a ferocity that we've never seen before. If we think we can be cute, we can lose. We need all the voters we can get, including those on the right that dislike their own party.
3. Only elections have saved this country. Not any stump speeches, policy initiatives, investigations or any kind of efforts we tried stopped them. Only turning out the vote and getting their votes counted did the job.
We have to do that job even better. The goal of the GOP is to figure out ways to divide the left and peel off voters.
Yes.
And in the short time between now and 2022 elections, produce meaningful results for people. Things Dems can campaign on. Biden's economic plans can peel off Republicans.
That kinda goes without saying doesn't it? I "know" the Democrats that are currently governing, will do the most they can to legislate the best policy the current conditions can muster. Our job, is to give them the power to do it. If, for example we lose the presidency in 2024 and they undo everything we've accomplished then we've really not done much.
Just don't get the cart before the horse. We do need successful policy initiatives to win the next election.
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Lemon Drop wrote:
[quote=vision63]
[quote=Lemon Drop]
[quote=vision63]
Lots of good stuff that people talk about but as far at priorities go, this is what needs to be focused on.
1. Considering that we're one Senator away from GOP control, holding our ranks in 2022 is paramount. Raphael Warnock's seat in particular is in up for grabs in 22 months.
2. We have to defend the House. We can easily lose House control in 2022. The GOP is going to fight with a ferocity that we've never seen before. If we think we can be cute, we can lose. We need all the voters we can get, including those on the right that dislike their own party.
3. Only elections have saved this country. Not any stump speeches, policy initiatives, investigations or any kind of efforts we tried stopped them. Only turning out the vote and getting their votes counted did the job.
We have to do that job even better. The goal of the GOP is to figure out ways to divide the left and peel off voters.
Yes.
And in the short time between now and 2022 elections, produce meaningful results for people. Things Dems can campaign on. Biden's economic plans can peel off Republicans.
That kinda goes without saying doesn't it? I "know" the Democrats that are currently governing, will do the most they can to legislate the best policy the current conditions can muster. Our job, is to give them the power to do it. If, for example we lose the presidency in 2024 and they undo everything we've accomplished then we've really not done much.
Just don't get the cart before the horse. We do need successful policy initiatives to win the next election.
It helps, but that's not a requirement to win. Just ask the Republicans. GOTV. That's how you win.
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Lemon Drop wrote:
Just don't get the cart before the horse. We do need successful policy initiatives to win the next election.
It's the economy stupid. Of course, not only the economy but the economy more than anything else - unless there are some unusual circumstances. One circumstance I can see causing clear breaks in the Republican edifice is if the militant far right do a series of violent attacks. If that happens, I think the Republicans are going to be in clear trouble in a great many elections for a while even if Biden can't make more alienated white working class people feel more financially secure.
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Ted King wrote:
[quote=Lemon Drop]
Just don't get the cart before the horse. We do need successful policy initiatives to win the next election.
It's the economy stupid. Of course, not only the economy but the economy more than anything else - unless there are some unusual circumstances. One circumstance I can see causing clear breaks in the Republican edifice is if the militant far right do a series of violent attacks. If that happens, I think the Republicans are going to be in clear trouble in a great many elections for a while even if Biden can't make more alienated white working class people feel more financially secure.
And the market dropped below 30K today.
Thanks, Joe.
Of course, the market isn't the economy, or even indicative of where the economy will go. Big game of craps with people's 401K money fueling the trading madness. There is only one winner there. The house.
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One policy initiative that would help is strengthening voters rights. The GOP accurately sees that in order to win, they need to suppress votes, and they’re going to be pretty blatant about it on a state level after 2020.
Yeah, the Repubs will throw mud like crazy at any federal effort to maintain or improve voting rights, but I think at this point, their efforts are pretty transparent, like trying to restrict early voting when we’ve just lived through a pandemic. Exactly what is wrong with early voting? How does voting over a slightly longer period increase the risk of voting fraud over trying to do it all in one day?
It doesn’t, and I think the average person will recognize that. The right has one real concern about it, and that’s that when more people actually get a chance to vote, they tend to vote Dem. And they don’t conceal that concern very well.
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Democrats need a few Zoom calls where the conversation goes like this:
"Do your colleagues on the other side of the aisle treat you as opponents or the enemy? We define the former as have policy differences and the latter as anarchy. If you have anarchists around you we recommend you respond at face value, and frame every single interaction thusly."
And then email everyone the PowerPoint slide showing those bullet point definitions. We need some basic, but coordinated methodologies here.
We're at a crossroads. You cannot "appeal" or "work with" someone who doesn't consider you an adversary worthy of consideration. Why worry about alienating people who literally do not care if you live or die?
Appealing to conservatives means nothing when conservatives stand for nothing but power for power's sake. Republican voters don't care about positive policy from anyone; it's why they reliably vote against their own interests like the one thing they can point to recently, their tax cut that only hurts them.
I see a few crises that need attention. Kill the filibusters and use the majority to protect and secure sweeping voting initiatives that give teeth against future SCOTUS attacks. SCOTUS just loves to say, "Well, we'd really prefer instead that Congress pass a law to address this ..." Democrats should truly take those frequent hints seriously. All of that works to put pressures on the state legislatures who work to stop voting.
Clone anything Stacey Abrams does. TN just got a young, new Democratic Party chair. He's already on record as saying he wants to duplicate what Abrams does. And we need to make noise. Republicans are saying the quiet part out loud, that they can't win when people vote. Amplify that to 11.
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Rs have shown again and again that they are only interested in sheer power. Not in America, or in democratic values. I had a convo with my wife earlier today about how to rid the nation of the Trumpster mindset. We are both incredulous (shouldn't be, I know) that they continue to embrace these vile, violence-fomenting Q-Anon crackpots like Boebert, Greene, etc.
My thought for a possible fix is that several sane persons in R leadership...need to come out repeatedly and ATTACK WITH ALL THEIR POWER USING HARD EVIDENCE on Trump and all his lawbreaking, all his fomenting of violence, cheating, etc. It will take a very large, very dedicated effort to unseat this mentality. And Mitch McConnell is doubtless the person most capable of pulling all the levers to make this happen. Surely he has a file of Trump's dirty deeds laying around for just such an occasion.
I don't know if there's any sizable number of Rs left in "leadership" who can and will stand up for what's right. I also don't know if this is even possible, given that they've all pretty much given him a pass this entire time. The toothpaste is out of the tube, etc.
I read an article this morning saying that idiot Matt Gaetz (FL blowhard mini-Trump) went to Liz Cheney's district and held an anti-Cheney rally that was very well-attended. That they're going primary her. And that the Rs are gonna have "hearings" next week on her ability to remain a House member.
Aside from all that, I agree with the notion of not working with horrid people, of extending a hand only so far as it doesn't prevent us from helping all Americans and doing what it takes (goodbye filibuster) for getting our agenda into reality. As of this moment, right now, I believe the Rs are going to take the same tack against Biden that they took against Obama. Nothing but destruction and gridlock. We're already seeing that.
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