How Brazil handles a school shooting

[Mr645]

sekker wrote:
[quote=Mr645]
I posted a link, I didn't claim anything.

A half truth.

If you want others to listen, providing context to why you felt the link important would help you tell whatever story you are advocating.

In this case, the others here just assumed you were talking the same points around guns that you did in the past.

With that extrapolation, the story doesn't support that view. Indeed, the entire first section are those in Brazil who are trying to get a better outcome than what we are seeing in the US.

I think it's good you point out that school shootings are terrible - that WAS your first point, right?

If we can start from that, we can have a constructive discussion.
I posted the story to open discussion how Brazil addressed school shootings with a variety of tactics, some I agree are sound, some not, a few simply not acceptable in the USA.

However the left simply blames the gun, somehow if we make AR-15s illegal, it will all stop.

[Mr645]

DeusxMac wrote:
[quote=Mr645]
I posted a link, I didn't claim anything. Then others chose to quote snippets that gave them peace of mind presenting to value their ideals.

Like CNN when they quote Trump "Fight like hell", editing bits of what he said

You rarely provide links to your claims, but when you do...
Don't remember making claims about your links that they actually did NOT substantiate??

Here's a few to refresh your memory:
https://forums.macresource.com/read.php?...sg-2820546
https://forums.macresource.com/read.php?...sg-2822157
https://forums.macresource.com/read.php?...sg-2822613

I don't see any reason to keep replying as you seem to cater the terms to find an outcome to give the results you want to see. Unlike most of the members here, most of congress, I took the time to learn about firearms, even bought a few this past year, and I learned that anger toward the AR-15 is a simply a political tactic. Nashville killer used a 9mm gun. The worst school shooting in US history, Virginia tech, the killer used 2 handguns, Glock 19 pistol, 9mm and a Walther P22 pistol that shoots tiny .22 rounds and typically used for target use only.

[DeusxMac]

Mr645 wrote:
…the left simply blames the gun, somehow if we make AR-15s illegal, it will all stop.

Straw man fallacy – misrepresenting an opponent's argument by broadening or narrowing the scope of a premise and/or refuting a weaker version of their argument

[Acer]

TIL I learned even a Walther P22 pistol that shoots tiny .22 rounds and typically used for target use only can be deadly. Perhaps we should ban those instead of AR-15s?

[JoeH]

"Tiny .22 rounds" in the case of the P22 are always high velocity .22 LR rounds, not .22 short which is the normal pistol round. Same diameter projectile as used in AR-15 rounds, just a somewhat smaller case and propellant load.

As I was taught for target shooting with .22 rifles, the round should always be considered potentially deadly.

[sekker]

Mr645 wrote:
[quote=sekker]
[quote=Mr645]
I posted a link, I didn't claim anything.

A half truth.

If you want others to listen, providing context to why you felt the link important would help you tell whatever story you are advocating.

In this case, the others here just assumed you were talking the same points around guns that you did in the past.

With that extrapolation, the story doesn't support that view. Indeed, the entire first section are those in Brazil who are trying to get a better outcome than what we are seeing in the US.

I think it's good you point out that school shootings are terrible - that WAS your first point, right?

If we can start from that, we can have a constructive discussion.
I posted the story to open discussion how Brazil addressed school shootings with a variety of tactics, some I agree are sound, some not, a few simply not acceptable in the USA.

However the left simply blames the gun, somehow if we make AR-15s illegal, it will all stop.
Where did I say anything about AR-15s?

I will engage in an active and honest discussion. Are you ready to do so?

[Mr645]

JoeH wrote:
"Tiny .22 rounds" in the case of the P22 are always high velocity .22 LR rounds, not .22 short which is the normal pistol round. Same diameter projectile as used in AR-15 rounds, just a somewhat smaller case and propellant load.

As I was taught for target shooting with .22 rifles, the round should always be considered potentially deadly.

.22LR rounds deliver 1/12th the energy of a .223 rifle round. The .22LR moves from a subsonic 750 fps to a high of almost 1300 fps when fired from rifles. The most powerful .22LR will leave the barrel of a Walther P22 at just over 1000 fps.
A .223 round moves between 2500 and 3000 fps and while virtually the same diameter, is a heavier, larger bullet.

Just shows that even a tiny .22LR bullet, the smallest, elastic's powerful popular round is deadly, just like a .223 AR round, or even a 50 BMG. All will kill a human if shot

[Mr645]

Also, the .22 Short, yes, slightly less energy than the .22LR, is virtually a dead caliber. a Few rifles fire it and a few single shot or double shot "gambler" revolvers shot it.
Many rifles designed for .22Long Rifle will also shoot the .22 short

[DeusxMac]

Mr645 wrote:
Also, the .22 Short, yes, slightly less energy than the .22LR, is virtually a dead caliber. a Few rifles fire it and a few single shot or double shot "gambler" revolvers shot it.
Many rifles designed for .22Long Rifle will also shoot the .22 short

Logic chopping fallacy - Focusing on trivial details of an argument, rather than the main point of the argumentation.

Ignoratio elenchi – an argument that may in itself be valid, but does not address the issue in question.

[Mr645]

DeusxMac wrote:
[quote=Mr645]
Also, the .22 Short, yes, slightly less energy than the .22LR, is virtually a dead caliber. a Few rifles fire it and a few single shot or double shot "gambler" revolvers shot it.
Many rifles designed for .22Long Rifle will also shoot the .22 short

Logic chopping fallacy - Focusing on trivial details of an argument, rather than the main point of the argumentation.

Ignoratio elenchi – an argument that may in itself be valid, but does not address the issue in question.
Agreed, trivial to single out the AR-15 when even the smallest common caliber is still deadly, and handguns are responsible for a majority of mass shootings.

Getting back on topic, we nee to address why people kill, apply a variety of efforts to secure our schools. Banning AR-15s or pistol braces is a useless tactic. As useless as our current president